FLUID-3671 Screen reader a11y and usability issues with Progress (esp. lack of feedback for screen reader users)
cclark at ocad.ca
Thu Sep 23 13:36:49 UTC 2010
Great feedback. A quick question:
You're using aria-live for the installation progress indicator in Drupal. It sounds like the experience is comparable to using aria-valuetext. That's what we're currently using in the Infusion Progress component to provide more descriptive information.
Aside from the bug in NVDA where aria-valuetext causes it to go silent, are there any other advantages to using aria-live instead of aria-valuetext for those descriptive labels? The one downside we've found with aria-live is that if progress happens quite quickly, the screen reader takes longer to read all the updates than the indicator took to finish.
Thoughts or advice?
On 2010-09-22, at 6:07 PM, E.J. Zufelt wrote:
> I think the best choice is going to be use-case dependent.
> In Drupal 7 we use aria-live for the installation progress indicator, basically because it was easy and quick to implement. But, we have something like the following being read:
> 28%, installing Field module, 13 of 28 completed.
> Which is overly verbose, but you can see that in this case knowing about the numeric progress alone is likely not enough.
> Probably a good generalization is to use valuenow, and to use aria-live on any dynamically changing text that is visible.
> Everett Zufelt
> Follow me on Twitter
> View my LinkedIn Profile
> On 2010-09-22, at 5:55 PM, Justin Obara wrote:
>> Just to reiterate and summarize the results of Golam's findings, there are a few options we have to indicate progress: 1) aria-valueNow 2)aria-valueText and 3) aria-live.
>> 1) aria-valueNow
>> By using aria-valueNow, screen reader users will be presented with an experience that is likely consistent with most progress indicators they will encounter. In NVDA progress will be announced via tones of increasing pitch. In JAWS it will just announce the number assigned to aria-valueNow like "25". ORCA is able to read the progressbar's label.
>> 2) aria-valueText
>> Using aria-valueText can provide the user with more information about the progress. However, it provides a somewhat different experience than what users may be familiar with. Currently NVDA doesn't work when aria-valueText is present, but it would be conceivable that when it does support aria-valueText, it will not announce with tones but read the text instead.
>> 3) aria-live could also be used, but the fact that the announcements can run on long after progress has actually completed, makes this solution seem less appealing.
>> Hope that helps
>> On 2010-09-21, at 5:58 PM, Chowdhury, Golam wrote:
>>> Hi Colin,
>>> I have completed testing progress with ORCA, JAWS_v11, and JAWS_v12(beta). If we use aria-valuenow then JAWS_11 and JAWS_12(beta) indicates that the progress has completed. If we use aria-live then both JAWS_v11 and JAWS_v12(beta) mentioned completion of progress in IE and in FireFox was very descriptive, also buffers information about progress. If we use aria-valuetext then both JAWS_v11 and JAWS_v12(beta) mentioned completion of progress in IE (pc-cursor and virtual-mode)and in FireFox was mentioning percent completed. ORCA always reading the label in all cases. For more information I have attached the test data, feel free to take a look at the test data and provide any kind of suggestions.
>>> Golam Chowdhury
>>> gchowdhury at ocad.ca | 416-977-6000 ext. 3962
>>> Software Developer
>>> Inclusive Design Research Centre (IDRC)
>>> OCAD University
>>> From: Colin Clark [colinbdclark at gmail.com]
>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 11:47 AM
>>> To: Chowdhury, Golam
>>> Cc: fluid-work at fluidproject.org
>>> Subject: Re: FLUID-3671 Screen reader a11y and usability issues with Progress (esp. lack of feedback for screen reader users)
>>> Justin, Golam, and I chatted further about these issues in the IRC channel today. Here's the log of our conversation:
>>> We're hoping to identify an implementation that can provide a decent user experience, so we're going to compare a few other screen readers to see how they perform. Golam is playing around with Orca now, and we'll also take a look at the latest version of JAWS.
>>> The takeaway from this investigation so far, I think, seems to be that the implementation of ARIA's progress bar role is pretty buggy in most current screen readers. We may also want to consider some additional labelling or graceful degradation support to make this work even with older, buggier ATs.
>>> Any advice or suggestions?
>>> On 2010-09-20, at 4:49 PM, Chowdhury, Golam wrote:
>>>> Hey Guys,
>>>> Issues with Screen Reader:
>>>> Current progress bar does not announce the progress bar status when using NVDA2010 screen reader using Fire Fox 3.5.9 and 3.6.9.
>>>> During our testing we have found two options. Option one using aria-valuenow and option two using aria-live. Following I have outlined the pros and cons for both of the options.
>>>> Option one using aria-valuenow:
>>>> -Just need to comment out the aria-valuetext
>>>> -Works in all cases
>>>> -Behaves similar to other progress indicators
>>>> -Doesn't buffer
>>>> -Not descriptive in JAWS
>>>> -Jaws doesn't announce completion
>>>> Option two using aria-live:
>>>> -Announce all progress states
>>>> -Works in all cases
>>>> -More code to add
>>>> -Buffer announcements (will keep announcing progress after complete)
>>>> -Behavior different then standard progress indicators
>>>> I prefer option one because of adding less code for our workaround and it works in most cases. Later on when NVDA fixes their issues with aria-valuetext then this will be a small code fix. I am attaching all the test cases I have tried. Any suggestion is welcome.
>>> Colin Clark
>>> Technical Lead, Fluid Project
>>> fluid-work mailing list - fluid-work at fluidproject.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change settings or access archives,
>>> see http://fluidproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fluid-work
>> fluid-work mailing list - fluid-work at fluidproject.org
>> To unsubscribe, change settings or access archives,
>> see http://fluidproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fluid-work
> fluid-work mailing list - fluid-work at fluidproject.org
> To unsubscribe, change settings or access archives,
> see http://fluidproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fluid-work
Technical Lead, Fluid Project
More information about the fluid-work