Editable fields WAS Date widget

John Norman john at caret.cam.ac.uk
Thu Jan 3 19:39:40 UTC 2008 

And 'goal management' too! Don't tell Sean :-)

Sort of worked for me. Told me something was going on although I  
wasn't sure what at first. Curious problem arose when their default  
todo's read like hyperlinks themselves. My first expectation was that  
clicking on the item would take me to the task (not edit the task  
title). Some people are really hard to please :-)

I think I'd be happy with some rollover cue's that I could turn off  
in preferences to give the Google behaviour, but I'm intrigued to  
think how we could be confident about rolling out just the Google  
behaviour because it is much cleaner. How many user tests would make  
me confident..?

John

On 3 Jan 2008, at 20:10, Clay Fenlason wrote:

> Take a look at Toodledo (www.toodledo.com).  They do a fairly nice
> thing with a tabulated list of entries (to-do tasks in their case).
> The row that your mouse is hovering over is highlighted, and the
> editable fields are "boxed" with a different highlight, and they
> manage this without being garish.  This works the same way for dates,
> text fields, or even attached notes and comments.
>
> You'll have to actually register and create some to-do tasks to see
> this all at work, but I think it's worth the exercise.
>
> ~Clay
>
> On Jan 3, 2008 1:56 PM, Sean Keesler <smkeesle at syr.edu> wrote:
>> Is there any chance of having two modes for such UI's?
>> One mode could show hints about the available features for newbies  
>> and
>> another mode could hide those cues, making the content the focus  
>> for users
>> familiar with the way the UI works.
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 1/3/08 1:43 PM, "Nate Angell" <nate.angell at rsmart.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Or alternatively, does anyone know of good usability data on
>>> "unmarked" editable areas? Some of my usability experience suggests
>>> that the majority of users try clicking on something they want to
>>> change whether it is marked as editable or not.
>>>
>>> On Jan 3, 2008, at 10:39 AM, Daphne Ogle wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jan 3, 2008, at 6:31 AM, John Norman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Google Calendar works well for this situation (once you work out
>>>>> how it works :-) ). It displays brief date information -  
>>>>> apparently
>>>>> as normal html - but when you click on the date info it becomes
>>>>> fully editable year, day and time. The usability challenge for me
>>>>> was that at first I didn't realise the date was editable. After
>>>>> thinking "how could Google write something so badly" for a  
>>>>> while, I
>>>>> clicked on the date out of frustration and behold, the editable
>>>>> interface was revealed unto me. With the help of an edit icon
>>>>> (pencil) I would probably have got there sooner, but now I know  
>>>>> how
>>>>> it works I like it.
>>>>
>>>> This is interesting and timely.  I'm struggling with this issue
>>>> right now in my Image Gallery designs.  We are planning to use in-
>>>> line editing.  Currently I've got a mix of using the edit icon and
>>>> not.  Mostly I've used it when there is a mix of information and
>>>> only some of it is editable.  I'm trying not to use the icon
>>>> everywhere because it just takes up so much room.  But it's
>>>> misleading an inconsistent to use it sometimes and not others.
>>>> However, in looking around at how others are making in-line editing
>>>> discoverable I haven't come across anything great.  John references
>>>> Google here.  I also like Flickr but they have the same issue that
>>>> until you know you can edit you just can't tell.  Any other good
>>>> examples out there people have seen?
>>>>
>>>> -Daphne
>>>>>
>>>>> This seems likely to be at variance with Yahoo patterns though...
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> On 3 Jan 2008, at 15:15, Clay Fenlason wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd add one further design consideration.  I know that there has
>>>>>> already been some discussion about a Fluid component for editing
>>>>>> bits
>>>>>> of the screen in place.  I think there are often locations  
>>>>>> where a
>>>>>> time and date are simply displayed when they should also  
>>>>>> probably be
>>>>>> editable (e.g. the assignments list as viewed by the instructor).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the same time, it's not always the case that you want the full
>>>>>> timestamp to be displayed (again, the assignments listing  
>>>>>> provides a
>>>>>> good example of where this becomes merely clutter, with its  
>>>>>> "open"
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> "due" dates slotted next to one another, and someone might  
>>>>>> also feel
>>>>>> that they want to add a third:  an "accept until" date).  You  
>>>>>> rarely
>>>>>> need to see the year specified, for example, and in certain  
>>>>>> contexts
>>>>>> even the time of day is secondary, although it should be easy to
>>>>>> check.  I imagine solutions where only the date is displayed  
>>>>>> at the
>>>>>> top level, and some sort of mouseover or popup reveals the  
>>>>>> full and
>>>>>> gory details if you have a reason to refer to them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ~Clay
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jan 3, 2008 12:21 AM,  <antranig at caret.cam.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi - really glad to see Fluid is preparing to devote some design
>>>>>>> cycles
>>>>>>> to this widget!
>>>>>>> Directing all towards the original requirements page for the  
>>>>>>> date
>>>>>>> widget started by Kathy:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://confluence.sakaiproject.org/confluence/display/RES/Date 
>>>>>>> +widget+impr
>>>>>>> ovements
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You can see all the discussion there, and also try out the
>>>>>>> templates
>>>>>>> for my implementation which is still up at
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://ponder.org.uk/RSFComponents-test/faces/test-components- 
>>>>>>> index
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You can grab the markup for the templates at
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://ponder.org.uk/RSFComponents-templates/content/ 
>>>>>>> templates/yahoo-date.
>>>>>>> html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> to be used in any design work that you would like to do from  
>>>>>>> here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Probably the biggest work that would need to be done to make  
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>> widget usable in the other display technologies would be to  
>>>>>>> rewrite
>>>>>>> the logic used for handling user timezones onto the client side
>>>>>>> rather than the server so that we can save on AJAX trips.  
>>>>>>> Although
>>>>>>> we could do without this by just deploying a single "standard
>>>>>>> widget"
>>>>>>> webapp into Sakai this would be a bit awkward.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Another issue seems to be that many locales (Denmark, South
>>>>>>> Africa, etc.)
>>>>>>> are complaining that the standard JDK locale information is not
>>>>>>> correct
>>>>>>> for them. We need to think about some architecture for  
>>>>>>> overriding/
>>>>>>> patching
>>>>>>> this, hopefully in a scheme that is not too Sakai-specific.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> Antranig.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Quoting Daphne Ogle <daphne at media.berkeley.edu>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sounds like a great idea Kristol!  I'd say go for it.   
>>>>>>>> Should we
>>>>>>>> create a new confluence space for this work or is there an
>>>>>>>> existing
>>>>>>>> one (that I can't find) that we should use?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Daphne
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jan 2, 2008, at 11:15 AM, Hancock, Kristol J wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hey guys!  I have a new hourly designer that has some time  
>>>>>>>>> on her
>>>>>>>>> hands right now and this may be a good project for her to  
>>>>>>>>> get her
>>>>>>>>> feet wet with Sakai.  Let me know what you think.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Kristol
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: Daphne Ogle [mailto:daphne at media.berkeley.edu]
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 1:57 PM
>>>>>>>>> To: Harriet Truscott
>>>>>>>>> Cc: 'Sakai UI UI'; fluid-work at fluidproject.org
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Date widget
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sounds like a wild and crazy New Year Harriet! :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A date widget component is not currently on the radar for
>>>>>>>>> Fluid.  It
>>>>>>>>> would sure be great to decide on an accessible and usable
>>>>>>>>> widget that
>>>>>>>>> we consistently use in Sakai.  I've lost track of where and  
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>> ones are used at this point.  Would it help if we put  
>>>>>>>>> together a
>>>>>>>>> little project to identify how and where we use various date
>>>>>>>>> pickers
>>>>>>>>> now?  Then we could do UX Walkthroughs and technical
>>>>>>>>> feasibility to
>>>>>>>>> assess the various ones in use?  I don't have a ton of time
>>>>>>>>> right now
>>>>>>>>> but am willing to work with others on this a bit if there are
>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>> takers.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -Daphne
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Jan 2, 2008, at 3:36 AM, Harriet Truscott wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hello all
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm celebrating the new year by going through my JIRA  
>>>>>>>>>> items, and
>>>>>>>>>> I've come
>>>>>>>>>> across
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> HYPERLINK http://jira.sakaiproject.org/jira/browse/SAK-11688
>>>>>>>>>> http://jira.sakaiproject.org/jira/browse/SAK-11688 , i.e.
>>>>>>>>>> "Replace
>>>>>>>>>> date
>>>>>>>>>> widget in Resources"
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Where are we up to on the whole date widget business? Is  
>>>>>>>>>> Fluid
>>>>>>>>>> working on
>>>>>>>>>> developing a lovely new date widget? Has a lovely new date
>>>>>>>>>> widget
>>>>>>>>>> (i.e. the
>>>>>>>>>> one used in Polls) been developed? If so, is this only for  
>>>>>>>>>> use
>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>> RSF tools?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> HYPERLINK http://jira.sakaiproject.org/jira/browse/SAK-7000
>>>>>>>>>> http://jira.sakaiproject.org/jira/browse/SAK-7000
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Happy New Year, everyone!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Harriet
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>>>>>>>>> - - -
>>>>>>>>>> - -
>>>>>>>>>> Centre for Applied Research in Educational Technologies
>>>>>>>>>> University of Cambridge
>>>>>>>>>> 16 Mill Lane
>>>>>>>>>> Cambridge
>>>>>>>>>> 01223 765 040
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>> 01/01/2008
>>>>>>>>>> 12:09
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>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Daphne Ogle
>>>>>>>>> Senior Interaction Designer
>>>>>>>>> University of California, Berkeley
>>>>>>>>> Educational Technology Services
>>>>>>>>> daphne at media.berkeley.edu
>>>>>>>>> cell (510)847-0308
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Daphne Ogle
>>>>>>>> Senior Interaction Designer
>>>>>>>> University of California, Berkeley
>>>>>>>> Educational Technology Services
>>>>>>>> daphne at media.berkeley.edu
>>>>>>>> cell (510)847-0308
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Clay Fenlason
>>>>>> Director, Educational Technology
>>>>>> Georgia Institute of Technology
>>>>>> (404) 385-6644
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> fluid-work mailing list
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>>>>
>>>> Daphne Ogle
>>>> Senior Interaction Designer
>>>> University of California, Berkeley
>>>> Educational Technology Services
>>>> daphne at media.berkeley.edu
>>>> cell (510)847-0308
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>
>> ------------------------------
>> Sean Keesler
>> Project Manager
>> The Living SchoolBook
>> 030 Huntington Hall
>> Syracuse University
>> 315-443-4768
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Clay Fenlason
> Director, Educational Technology
> Georgia Institute of Technology
> (404) 385-6644
> _______________________________________________
> fluid-work mailing list
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